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Talk:CIA Director
We shouldn't really refer to him as John McCone since his name isn't mentioned in any of the games. The mention on his physical resemblance, in the "Behind the Scenes" section, is enough. --Bluerock 10:58, May 1, 2010 (UTC) :Well we can't call him DCI or CIA Director either since now there are more than one DCI in the Metal Gear history (John McCone and Coldman). DCI isn't even a name (codename or real name), it's just a title in the CIA. Besides, in the novels, there is mention of a certain white-haired president that participated in Les Enfants Terribles project (never naming the president), and we all assumed that it was Nixon. - Marcaurelix ::Who said Coldman was a DCI? And I think Nixon shouldn't be explicitly named either, unless Peace Walker mentions him. --Bluerock 11:43, May 1, 2010 (UTC) :::Weedle's information from Peace Walker mentions that Coldman was the DCI during Operation Snake Eater. - Marcaurelix ::::All we know so far is that he was in the CIA, not that he was the Director. Weedle likely assumed this because Coldman has apparently been revealed to be the "deviously cunning strategist". We'll just have to wait until he provides any sources/references or else its going to create more confusion with all the re-edits. --Bluerock 11:49, May 1, 2010 (UTC) :::::Fair enough. I'll wait. But if Coldman is finally confirmed as the DCI during MGS3, then I suggest changing the "CIA Director" page, renaming it "John McCone." - Marcaurelix :Well, it would be better to call it "CIA Director (1964-1970)" if thats the case. --Bluerock 12:07, May 1, 2010 (UTC) ::We could argue that, but he does need a name because I wonder how this sounds in his biography: "CIA Director (1964-1970), before becoming the DCI, gave the greenlight..." or "CIA Director (1964-1970), presumably having become the DCI after Coldman was ousted of office..." Check out his biography to know what I mean. - Marcaurelix :::Not necessarily, if he wasn't the DCI at that time, then it would have been Coldman who gave the greenlight for the mission. There's nothing about him that occurred before he was DCI that would be in the article anyway, you see what I mean? --Bluerock 12:22, May 1, 2010 (UTC) ::::Weedle has just confirmed that Coldman was the DCI and the "deviously cunning strategist" - Marcaurelix :::::Yes, I mentioned where it was stated in my User Talk. I even made sure I linked the sources. Weedle McHairybug 12:27, May 1, 2010 (UTC) ::::::And what are we going to do now with the CIA Director page? Do we change the name or do we follow Bluerock's suggestion? - Marcaurelix :As I said on Weedle's talk page (gonna write here from now on), the quotes don't really answer the question about whether Coldman was the DCI at the time, only that he had planned the operation to kill the Boss. He may have become DCI after his predecessor's death in 1970, and then lost it just before Peace Walker. We need to wait for the whole game first rather than make assumptions. --Bluerock 12:34, May 1, 2010 (UTC) :The scene where he caught Big Boss implies that the reason why he was demoted to the CIA Station Chief of Central America was because he knew too much about the operation and was a convenient way to remove him. The only way that such a possibility should occur is if he was the DCI by the time of Operation Snake Eater, and was then demoted shortly before the mission's end (If the CIA were truly concerned about such information being leaked out, especially by one of their own members, I'm pretty sure that they would do such a thing.). Anyways, at least I tried to explain it, and good point, we should wait for the release of the game (I mean, yeah, we have the GN cutscenes translated, but not the other aspects). Weedle McHairybug 12:40, May 1, 2010 (UTC) ::Damn, I hate retcons. So they decided to demote him in the middle of a mission (Operation Snake Eater) just to make sure it didn't clash with the McCone look-alike's appearance at the end of MGS3. This is going to be a very long 1 1/2 month wait. --Bluerock 12:47, May 1, 2010 (UTC) :::Either in the middle of the mission or directly after it. And yes, retcons do suck. BTW Bluerock, I was thinking about your CIA Director (1964-1970) suggestion and I think it could work. - Marcaurelix ::::Well, to be fair, we never actually saw the CIA Director until during the award ceremony, and his reaction towards Gene pointing and launching a Nuclear Missile (as well as his assassination thereafter due to FOX not guarding the bunker) implies that he wasn't that good of a strategist. Weedle McHairybug 12:59, May 1, 2010 (UTC) :Yes, you're right, there was a period of time between the end of the mission and the award ceremony. Still, the way Snake refuses to shake his hand implied that he held this director responsible, despite being a last minute promotion, which I'm sure he must have known. But, I guess he just felt the whole government was to blame, regardless of who actually planned the mission. --Bluerock 13:06, May 1, 2010 (UTC) :You know, I just remembered something. When Ocelot was calling the DCI at the end of Operation Snake Eater, he said "That's right, I was the one they called ADAM." That's a pretty strange thing to say to someones boss if, being in charge of the mission, the same boss knew who ADAM was (since ADAM was recruited by the CIA for the occasion that something like what Volgin was going to do happened, Ocelot was bound to have given at least one call to his boss at langley prior to the official start of the mission.), unless he wasn't in charge of the mission until very later on, and only heard of ADAM, at best. Weedle McHairybug 13:31, May 5, 2010 (UTC) ::Actually, he said "Yes, it appears that no one knew that I was ADAM". He was talking about Big Boss, EVA, Volgin and the other Russians. Of course, the DCI knew he was ADAM. -- 20:46, May 5, 2010 (UTC) The DCI during 'Operation Snake Eater' and 'San Hieronymo Takeover' Hi all I have been reading my way through the history of MGS, so much stuff to get your head around ! I want someone to confirm whether I am correct in saying - the DCI during SNAKE EATER is Coldman and then he gets fired where a new person becomes the DCI who is killed during the San Hieronymo Takeover. I am asking this because when I heard Coldman was in Peacewalker, I wondered how this was possible when I beleived he was killed during the takerover event.